druid
Junior Member
Posts: 93
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Post by druid on Sept 26, 2020 23:53:32 GMT
Song gets better with every listen!
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Post by markus on Sept 29, 2020 16:02:02 GMT
For me, this track has a "Flat Out 2" vibe to it - it doesn't scream "BOC", but maybe that's the point, I dunno... but those lyrics... maybe I'm in my own box in my head here, but I have a six-foot long box I'd like to bury nearly all of John Shirley's entire lyrical output in...  Ralph, you hit on a salient point as to what makes those early BOC recordings so unique - the chemistry between the original 5 and their contributions in arrangement and playing (and of course the Pearlman zeitgeist which completed the didactic circle). Yes, the solo BD compositions do sound like they could be on FO2, but that's true of *any* BD compositions from the classic era and beyond. The BOC-ness that has resonated over the decades was born out from the unique contributions that just gelled with their skill set (again, not necessarily virtuosity, but chemistry). For example, EB and BD share a composition credit for HoEyes, the riff is based on the same minor chord boogie pattern/motif EB used in the Subhuman (and, to be fair, that JB used in Moon Crazy). I'd be willing to bet that BD's input on HoEyes made that a much more unique tune rather than the rather straightforward Subhuman; and thus a classic was born. You see this type of compositional interplay on a lot of the early classic material (check the credits) and then really falling off (not totally) as the band's career progressed; combining that with the reduced/eliminated Pearlman thrall/influence and the tossing aside of the neo-Wagnerian/Yockey gestalt, and there you are. IOTW, we shouldn't be surprised that BD compositions sounds like BD on BOC records (even on a harder edged record like Cultosaurus, BD gave us Deadline), we shouldn't expect them (or an EB or RichieC tune) to sound like classic BOC *especially* with the missing Pearlmanesque element. That simply won't happen, and frankly, wouldn't it feel terribly cliched/awkward if BD and EB came up with some faux Pearlman Man in the High Castle-type concept with song titles like Before the Anschluss a Nightcap, AR234, Dominance and Lebensraum, 7 Screaming Nebelwerfers, etc. Let art flow naturally and let's look back at the classic era as magic and accept what the band is creating now as the direction/creativity of their choosing. |
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Post by The Ocean on Sept 29, 2020 16:26:38 GMT
For me, this track has a "Flat Out 2" vibe to it - it doesn't scream "BOC", but maybe that's the point, I dunno... but those lyrics... maybe I'm in my own box in my head here, but I have a six-foot long box I'd like to bury nearly all of John Shirley's entire lyrical output in... Ralph, you hit on a salient point as to what makes those early BOC recordings so unique - the chemistry between the original 5 and their contributions in arrangement and playing (and of course the Pearlman zeitgeist which completed the didactic circle). Yes, the solo BD compositions do sound like they could be on FO2, but that's true of *any* BD compositions from the classic era and beyond. The BOC-ness that has resonated over the decades was born out from the unique contributions that just gelled with their skill set (again, not necessarily virtuosity, but chemistry). For example, EB and BD share a composition credit for HoEyes, the riff is based on the same minor chord boogie pattern/motif EB used in the Subhuman (and, to be fair, that JB used in Moon Crazy). I'd be willing to bet that BD's input on HoEyes made that a much more unique tune rather than the rather straightforward Subhuman; and thus a classic was born. You see this type of compositional interplay on a lot of the early classic material (check the credits) and then really falling off (not totally) as the band's career progressed; combining that with the reduced/eliminated Pearlman thrall/influence and the tossing aside of the neo-Wagnerian/Yockey gestalt, and there you are. IOTW, we shouldn't be surprised that BD compositions sounds like BD on BOC records (even on a harder edged record like Cultosaurus, BD gave us Deadline), we shouldn't expect them (or an EB or RichieC tune) to sound like classic BOC *especially* with the missing Pearlmanesque element. That simply won't happen, and frankly, wouldn't it feel terribly cliched/awkward if BD and EB came up with some faux Pearlman Man in the High Castle-type concept with song titles like Before the Anschluss a Nightcap, AR234, Dominance and Lebensraum, 7 Screaming Nebelwerfers, etc. Let art flow naturally and let's look back at the classic era as magic and accept what the band is creating now as the direction/creativity of their choosing. I'm in total agreement with what you are saying. A band in time is a band in evolution. A band without change is a band that has stagnated. I haven't bought a single AC/DC record since Stiff Upper Lip because I mean... nothing ever changes, and the new record will just be the old record again and again. I also think, because there is a mindset that these songs "aren't very BOC," which I respect if i don't agree with, that BOC is what BOC says BOC is. My view is that if we say that a band's output is beholden to elements of previous records, you could day in 1976 that Agents of Fortune was not BOC. I mean, where does True Confessions fit in with the band who made Seven Screaming Diz Busters and Harvester of Eyes, after all? Even if we move ahead to 1981 and Agents through Cultosaurus are accepted, Fire of Unknown Origin was a hell of a curveball in terms of instrumentation and sound. And yet, that's for sure a BOC record that has been embraced by the fandom. This to me is another element of their output. Somebody previously mentioned (and I am sorry that i forget who) Trevor Rabin, Yes, and Owner of a Lonely Heart. 90215 had a new member who exerted a large influence on their sound, changing it, but it WAS Yes. Richie's influence has added new elements to their sound for sure, but I don't see the harm in that. Especially given the buzz about The Alchemist and how people across the way and some interviewers are saying it's vintage BOC. But that's Richie's song. So, regardless of the quality of the songs which I know there are some disagreements on, I do feel like this is authentically BOC. Whether that's for better or worse is uo to the listener. Me personally, with everything I've heard so far, I'm gonna spin that bastard immediately when it arrives in the mail, volume at max. |
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Post by zenman on Sept 29, 2020 17:53:02 GMT
For me, this track has a "Flat Out 2" vibe to it - it doesn't scream "BOC", but maybe that's the point, I dunno... but those lyrics... maybe I'm in my own box in my head here, but I have a six-foot long box I'd like to bury nearly all of John Shirley's entire lyrical output in... frankly, wouldn't it feel terribly cliched/awkward if BD and EB came up with some faux Pearlman Man in the High Castle-type concept with song titles like Before the Anschluss a Nightcap, AR234, Dominance and Lebensraum, 7 Screaming Nebelwerfers, etc. LOLOL, well done. |
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Post by duckbarman on Sept 29, 2020 22:44:15 GMT
For me, this track has a "Flat Out 2" vibe to it - it doesn't scream "BOC", but maybe that's the point, I dunno... but those lyrics... maybe I'm in my own box in my head here, but I have a six-foot long box I'd like to bury nearly all of John Shirley's entire lyrical output in... Ralph, you hit on a salient point as to what makes those early BOC recordings so unique - the chemistry between the original 5 and their contributions in arrangement and playing (and of course the Pearlman zeitgeist which completed the didactic circle). Yes, the solo BD compositions do sound like they could be on FO2, but that's true of *any* BD compositions from the classic era and beyond. The BOC-ness that has resonated over the decades was born out from the unique contributions that just gelled with their skill set (again, not necessarily virtuosity, but chemistry). For example, EB and BD share a composition credit for HoEyes, the riff is based on the same minor chord boogie pattern/motif EB used in the Subhuman (and, to be fair, that JB used in Moon Crazy). I'd be willing to bet that BD's input on HoEyes made that a much more unique tune rather than the rather straightforward Subhuman; and thus a classic was born. You see this type of compositional interplay on a lot of the early classic material (check the credits) and then really falling off (not totally) as the band's career progressed; combining that with the reduced/eliminated Pearlman thrall/influence and the tossing aside of the neo-Wagnerian/Yockey gestalt, and there you are. IOTW, we shouldn't be surprised that BD compositions sounds like BD on BOC records (even on a harder edged record like Cultosaurus, BD gave us Deadline), we shouldn't expect them (or an EB or RichieC tune) to sound like classic BOC *especially* with the missing Pearlmanesque element. That simply won't happen, and frankly, wouldn't it feel terribly cliched/awkward if BD and EB came up with some faux Pearlman Man in the High Castle-type concept with song titles like Before the Anschluss a Nightcap, AR234, Dominance and Lebensraum, 7 Screaming Nebelwerfers, etc. Let art flow naturally and let's look back at the classic era as magic and accept what the band is creating now as the direction/creativity of their choosing. I can't argue with any of what you say - and I thought "chemistry" was a good word to put up for consideration to try and describe the uniqueness of BOC that I think we all felt back in the day - although I should admit that, earlier, I sent off several of my remaining brain cells into a corner to argue the pros and cons of hearing BOC perform "7 Screaming Nebelwerfers" and... oh wait - hang on, after some deliberation, they've just sent a spokesman back to ask for a clarification... oh... OK, he's asked: "can they hear a 30 second sample first..."? <irrelevant aside> Talking of aberrant neurons, and for some reason I can't adequately explain, your post somewhat weirdly reminded me of a piece on BOC I was just re-reading earlier today written by Danny Sugerman from October 1973 which described the potential delights which we would be getting on the forthcoming double BOC LP - here's what was tantalisingly said in that piece: "Yeah, anyway," Bloom continued, "Tyranny & Mutation is a record conceived as an injection and I don't think anyone has ever done that before."
"Our next record is a move in a broader sense," Bouchard moved. "This one was a bit narrow and the first was... it tried to accomplish too much. This one is narrow harmonically. The next will have far more harmonies - but it won't be no Crosby, Stills & Nash."
The titles for their up-coming double LP read like the score to a science fiction conglomerate drama/thriller: "'Mommy' is by R. Meltzer and we're thinking of which Australian girl to dedicate it to, 'Harvester of Eyes' comes next followed by 'Cagey Creaton' [sic], 'Dominance and Submission' by Sandy, 'Shot While Trying to Escape', which is our first blues number and was influenced by Humphrey Bogart, 'Flaming Telepaths', 'ME-262', 'Career of Evil' by Patti Smith, 'Come Ladies Fish and Gentlemen', about the Blue Oyster Cult, 'After the Kiss' which runs into 'Blackcap' and then 'Captain's Tongue'.Blimey... The mind boggles... I can't help thinking that those Secret Treaties demos would have made for some interesting listening... oh, and by the way, did I mention the fact that it was going to be a double LP...? I did...? OK, just checking... and to think back when I was in school, I didn't appreciate the wonders that "chemistry" could achieve... </aside> |
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Post by The Ocean on Oct 4, 2020 17:58:58 GMT
I'm not sure if it was just for the video but I noticed that Buck plays the riff (or at least at the beginning) with two downstrokes, and Richie begins with an upstroke. Probably difficult to hear on the record given the layers and distortion, but I bet if the Boys ever do an acoustic version it'll bring a real nice extra texture to the song.
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Post by marty on Oct 9, 2020 1:00:10 GMT
My current fave!
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Post by djhjr86 on Oct 15, 2020 13:25:04 GMT
This is, IMHO, the catchiest song since "Burnin' For You" that they've recorded. And I dig the little homage to "Brandy" by Looking Glass towards the end of the song.
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Post by beanguy on Oct 15, 2020 22:37:37 GMT
The box keeps getting stuck in my head.
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Post by tororo1861 on Oct 23, 2020 20:01:05 GMT
To be honest, general vibe of the song would have fit right in with Mirrors, but that crunchy riff feels like it would have fit on Heaven Forbid, too.
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